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  • Stuck between a rock and a hard place

    I fully expect to get a bunch of mean remarks to my post, but I'm posting anyways because I really need some constructive advice on this situation.

    A lot has happened since we got Emma a year and a half ago! Firstly, I believe Emma has some type of bladder problem, which has kept her from being a regular inside part of our house. For about 8 months we let her inside all the time and she continually peed in the house even though she knew she wasn't supposed to. It seemed to be a nighttime thing and we tried everything we could think of, including taking her to the vet (who could not find anything wrong with her). She almost "wet the bed" like a little kid. She would litterally go pee on her bed in her sleep. As I'm sure you know, it is no small matter when a Dane pees in the house. At any rate, we tried for months and months and months to do everything we could with her, and it just wasn't working, so she became mostly an outside dog (along with our other dog, Bo, who has mostly always been an inside dog, we didn't want her to be alone). This was a very difficult transition for me, but we do everything we can to spend as much time outside with her as possible, and she is set up with a nice insulated dog house and large kennel area. We also leave as many toys and bones as possible in the yard and kennel for she and Bo.

    Last November, my husband and I had our first child, as well, which brought a whole new set of problems. Our child was premature and to be honest, the dogs were neglected for a while while we dealt with all of that. Maybe neglected is too strong of a word, but we were not able to spend as much time with them as we would have liked to. We are getting better as our tiny daughter becomes healthier, but we both work full time, as well, and there's a lot to keep up with.

    Lastly, the biggest problem of the moment is that Emma has been digging. Digging giant craters in our yard, and my husband is fed up and keeps threatening to make me get rid of her. This is the LAST thing I want, as I've never seen myself as the type of person who would give up on my dog...she's a member of my family! I have grown to love her very much. I'm not sure what to do at this point, though, and I thought some of you might have some insight. I have been getting out with her daily to throw the ball and/or take her for walks, and she is still digging whenever she gets out of the kennel even for a few minutes without supervision. I don't feel right about locking her in the kennel all day every day except for when we play ball or walk, but as I said, each time she is let out to wander in the yard she digs big craters (and ignores her toys and bones and even Bo, our other dog!), and my husband continues with his threats. Does anyone have any suggestions to help us cope with this?

    Emma has done well with training and knows all of the basic commands such as heel, sit, stay, drop it (when playing ball), shake, be gentle (which we taught her when we had our baby...who she does great with), and speak. She is a good dog but we really need to come up with something here on this issue. I know that a main reason for digging is not enough exercise or attention, but I am trying to do the best I can juggling my premature daughter's medical problems, my husband, my house, and my job. I am completely stressed out over all of this.

    Do any of you have Danes that live mainly outdoors? Do they dig? What do you do about it? Please be brutally honest (but hopefully constructive, too), I really want to find a good solution.

    JennS

  • #2
    RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

    I don't have anything mean to say, as I know thats not what you wanted.. I don't have anything to say about the digging except it is most likely because of stress and not enough exercise. The pee thing, sounds alot like a case of a lab I knew of.. First how old is she???? And has she always peed through her life? or did it start becoming bad after say 6mos old?? It could be that she was not quite mad right.. I'll explain. Sometimes in vary rare situations female (mostly) dogs are made without a bladder or have a very small bladder. Sometimes they also have holes that seem to constantly flow. But from what you said, it sounds like she does not have the perfectly made bladder, I hope that helps maybe you could talk to the vet about it.
    Becky

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    • #3
      RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

      Let me be clear that I mostly need advice on the digging thing as that seems to be the make or break problem with my husband right now.

      Comment


      • #4
        RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

        Thanks for your reply, I appreciate the idea and will try to look into it.

        Comment


        • #5
          RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

          Hello!! Long time no see!

          >A lot has happened since we got Emma a year and a half ago!
          >Firstly, I believe Emma has some type of bladder problem,
          >which has kept her from being a regular inside part of our
          >house. For about 8 months we let her inside all the time and
          >she continually peed in the house even though she knew she
          >wasn't supposed to. It seemed to be a nighttime thing and we
          >tried everything we could think of, including taking her to
          >the vet (who could not find anything wrong with her). She
          >almost "wet the bed" like a little kid. She would litterally
          >go pee on her bed in her sleep. As I'm sure you know, it is
          >no small matter when a Dane pees in the house. At any
          >rate, we tried for months and months and months to do
          >everything we could with her, and it just wasn't working, so
          >she became mostly an outside dog (along with our other dog,
          >Bo, who has mostly always been an inside dog, we didn't want
          >her to be alone). This was a very difficult transition for
          >me, but we do everything we can to spend as much time outside
          >with her as possible, and she is set up with a nice insulated
          >dog house and large kennel area. We also leave as many toys
          >and bones as possible in the yard and kennel for she and Bo.

          I'm a little confused that you are blaming this all on a bladder problem. I don't mean to be unfair, but I clearly remember her having bowel issues and that you were feeding the Costco brand kibble and spending a lot of time at the vet and leaving her outside because of the diarrhea. Despite the costly vet visits that weren't being successful, last we talked you and your husband did not feel a more quality food was worth it.

          I'm also confused as to why a night time pee problem means she has to stay outside at all times.

          Some females lose control of their bladders in sleep. I've heard that giving the OTC hormone replacement pills helps, but they should also grow out of it.

          Do you even know if this is still a problem? If she is outside, how do you know if her pee issue is still an issue?

          >Last November, my husband and I had our first child, as well,
          >which brought a whole new set of problems. Our child was
          >premature and to be honest, the dogs were neglected for a
          >while while we dealt with all of that. Maybe neglected is too
          >strong of a word, but we were not able to spend as much time
          >with them as we would have liked to. We are getting better as
          >our tiny daughter becomes healthier, but we both work full
          >time, as well, and there's a lot to keep up with.

          Congratulations on your baby girl!!
          Can I ask why you never asked for help? Why not hire a dog walker?
          I would have been happy to come out and pick Emma up for some playtime or just bring Parker over for some wrestling. I understand that a human child is a priority but its been 9 months since you had the child, not to mention the time you were pregnant, to look for some things to do to help keep her entertained.


          >Lastly, the biggest problem of the moment is that Emma has
          >been digging. Digging giant craters in our yard, and my
          >husband is fed up and keeps threatening to make me get rid of
          >her. This is the LAST thing I want, as I've never seen myself
          >as the type of person who would give up on my dog...she's a
          >member of my family!

          While I strongly feel a pet is forever, which is worse:
          keeping a dog because you feel you should and not having enough time for her, or taking her in to a very reputable and successful rescue so that she goes to a home with the time and energy for her?

          I have grown to love her very much. I'm
          >not sure what to do at this point, though, and I thought some
          >of you might have some insight. I have been getting out with
          >her daily to throw the ball and/or take her for walks, and she
          >is still digging whenever she gets out of the kennel even for
          >a few minutes without supervision. I don't feel right about
          >locking her in the kennel all day every day except for when we
          >play ball or walk, but as I said, each time she is let out to
          >wander in the yard she digs big craters (and ignores her toys
          >and bones and even Bo, our other dog!), and my husband
          >continues with his threats. Does anyone have any suggestions
          >to help us cope with this

          She's bored. Tossing the ball around the yard she sees constantly, or walking with you, are not enough stimulation for her. So when there is no one there to correct her, of course she is going to dig. Some people have found that building a sandbox helps, or others use deterrents like burying poop or balloons. Personally I think its a matter of training, satisfying the dog's needs, and supervision.

          >
          >Emma has done well with training and knows all of the basic
          >commands such as heel, sit, stay, drop it (when playing ball),
          >shake, be gentle (which we taught her when we had our
          >baby...who she does great with), and speak. She is a good dog
          >but we really need to come up with something here on this
          >issue. I know that a main reason for digging is not enough
          >exercise or attention, but I am trying to do the best I can
          >juggling my premature daughter's medical problems, my husband,
          >my house, and my job. I am completely stressed out over all
          >of this.

          Why do you want to keep her? You are stressed, don't have time for her, and can't even have her in your home. How much time do you really even get to spend with her?

          >Do any of you have Danes that live mainly outdoors? Do they
          >dig? What do you do about it? Please be brutally honest (but
          >hopefully constructive, too), I really want to find a good
          >solution.


          I really can't imagine a Dane living mainly outdoors here. It is cold, rainy and absolutely nasty most of the year! So she has an insulated dog house...that doesn't mean when it is raining for nine months straight that you are going to want to go hang out with her.
          Right now it is nice out and it is easier to think you will go out and spend time with her. But even now, you have a lot on your plate. Come fall it will be cold and raining and after a long day, are you going to go stand out in the rain and hang out with her? Cuddle with her in her dog house?

          Jenn I really really really hope you don't take this all the wrong way. I am not at all trying to be mean. I know you love Emma, but are you really able to give her the life she deserves? Really think about what you would want for her and what her life should be.

          Comment


          • #6
            RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

            My advice is to find her a new home where someone will have more time for her. It isn't fair to her in my opinion for you to keep her just because you would feel bad about placing her somewhere else. Keeping her for any other reason then she is a huge part of your family (which she clearly is not) is a selfish thing to do. Not being mean, but I know a lot of breeders even who keep dogs because they think it makes THEM look bad to place a dog and it's wrong. She deserves a better life. Don't beat yourself up for it. #### happens. but do the right thing by her now. It will be painful to say goodbye, but someday you will realize you did the right thing.
            Think of it as doing something FOR HER, not something you did TO HER.
            Good Luck!




            "The person who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the person doing it."
            Brother and sister! Indie and CH Carina taking the 4 point majors!
            http://eastwooddanes.homestead.com/C...MajorPic1a.jpg
            www.eastwooddanes.com
            Kim E.

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            • #7
              RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

              I have to agree with Kim here. It sounds like your life is just too hectic right now to give her the proper attention.

              Also, Alisha is correct about the incontinence and a female. This is common in young females and they often outgrow it by a year old or so (or as my vet said, by their first heat). Your girl may very well not have that problem anymore and be able to come inside where she belongs.

              Comment


              • #8
                RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place


                I think Ali said it all. :e) :e) :e)

                The best thing for Emma right now would be to rehome her.
                You've got so much going on now..and with the husband and his threats, maybe find her a new place before he does.

                If you love her, you'll want what is best for her. That is the main issue...and if you do rehome her, please bring the other dog back in because it's not fair to him.

                Good Luck
                Dee
                sigpic

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                • #9
                  RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

                  I also agree with Kim stop thinking about you think about her. She is bored and probably not happy being in a yard all day with the other dog.
                  This girl sounds like she needs to have a job to keep her mind busy. She would probably make a great obedience or agility, rally dog. Bored dog become very distructive and worse things can happen then just your yard being dug up ?
                  She needs to have a life with a job and with a new baby there is no way you will be able to provide her with that. Hopefully you can find a home that will love her and have fun with her
                  Yes the peeing thing is very common in bitches it does happen allot with girls that are older or have been spay you girl could grow out of it or maybe just meds will help the problem. Best of luck to you and your girl .

                  Painted Meadows
                  Lisa Harm
                  Http://paintedmeadows.net/

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                  • #10
                    RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

                    I would rule out diabetes & check out the other female incontinence issues discussed by other posters. It does not appear that you are looking for a way to bring her inside, which is where I'd be looking, but a way to get her to behave while outside. As I'm sure you are aware Danes are not outside dogs, they are people dogs, in many cases more human than dog.

                    What you have on your hands is a bored & lonely child. If I were to tell my human children that they could only play in the yard with these toys & only each other & left them to their own devices, I'm afraid of the consequences, dogs are no different, they need variety, companionship & leadership. Your dog has none of those things or such limited access to be paramount to none. Instead of focusing on ways to live outside I would be working on ways to be part of the family who chose her. When you chose a dog you are committing to offering them the best life you can give them, if you can't provide it, then do the best thing for them & allow them that life elsewhere.

                    I don't mean to be harsh, but put yourself in her shoes, would you be happy?
                    Mitch
                    In Memory of Gabe. What he lacked in body he made up for in heart.
                    Click here to see my boys
                    [http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4288799713]
                    In the Chicagoland area? Click here to inquire about pet sitting & dog training
                    http://www.knowplacepe

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                    • #11
                      RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

                      If she's digging really badly, maybe use rock sand for the floor of her kennel. If she's in a kennel like a huge pen, then the pen would be considered a permanent part of the yard right? I'd put some concrete blocks or maybe some brick around the inside perimeter of the kennel and fill it with several inches of rock sand. If you're not sure what that is, it's blue and looks like kitty litter. It packs down like concrete and her pee will drain down into it and it wont make mud. Her messes will be easy to sweep up because the sand stays dry. It's not like beach sand. Some landscaping places may call it number ten rock sand. It's ground up limestone sand. As for digging, It's a constant thing with danes. Some dogs that stay ourdoors like to dig shallow holes to lay down in because it's cooler. It's summer time now. Is she hot? Maybe she's just trying to cool down by digging laying holes. It's hard to break them of the digging, so if you have her in her own kennel and a place that she can call hers and only hers, then it shouldn't matter if she digs holes in it. But the rock sand may help stop her a bit the way it packs. It's softer on her feet and joints to jump up and down on rather than a solid concrete kennel floor or hard dirt ground of the yard. You can also sift some Seven 10 or Seven 5 dust into it and it helps keep fleas down a LOT. Just a few suggestions.

                      Many danes will dig holes whether they are in a kennel or just out in the yard loose. It's a hobby of theirs it seems. You just gotta give them their own room indoors or their own space outdoors where they can tear up and wreck and take things apart and just be as messy and goofy as they want. It's really hard to have a dane and have a neat yard. They can be destructive. So just give her her own space that she can mess up and where it wont bother your husband.
                      Hope that helped.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

                        Hi Jenn, I don't post very often, but felt the need.I know this is a very hard thing to think of and talk about. I had my 1st dane @ 5 years ago. And I loved him ver,very much. When Luke was 1yr I all the sudden found myself a single mom with 2 kids, living in an apartment, working as a vet tech from 7am-6pm, then waiting tables from 7pm til usually 1am (very long days). I started to notice Luke was having some seperation anxiety issues(who could blame him). I was doing the best I could. My life changed, I never thought I could be without him.....he was my 3rd baby. But I had to think of Him, not me, or how much I love him and didn't want to fail him.I found him a wonderful new home and keep in some contact with his family as to updates. It was the hardest thing I had to do, I miss him, but at the time...it was best for him. To me, sometimes to love is to let go.I know you prob didn't want to hear that response but I wanted to share.Hope it helps.
                        Now years later,(i swore i would get another)I just got remarried and am home all day. We have our baby Rigger (8 month old white merle)he will never be Luke, but I know I made the right choice.

                        P.S. I'm glad to hear your daughter is getting better.

                        Kimberly & Rigger

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                        • #13
                          RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

                          Just one more thought:

                          If the incontinence in the house is your main problem, leading to the dog being out, thus bored and lonely, thus digging, why not get her one of those doggy diapers so she can be in? I know they look dumb and you may have to explain, but if you really want to be able to keep her, put a diaper on her and make her part of your family. I bet a lot of the frustration behaviors would go away. If you can't, then I agree with a lot of other posters: this is probably not the right situation for her, and as hard as it is, you may need to rehome her for her sake.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

                            I can't say that I disagree with the advice to rehome the dog. It's a very difficult decision, but maybe the best. I know how hard it is to have a premature infant. It can also be tough on your relationship with your hubby. If the dog is becoming yet another source of contention it is likely not fair to the dog to keep her in a stressful situation.

                            However, if you feel that you absolutely want to keep her, here's a few things to remember. Your baby will almost certainly get healthier and easier. My daughter was 14 weeks premature, spent 84 days in the NICU and was very sick. The first year of her life was very difficult. We also have a deaf son who is 15 months older than her. So I can definitely understand how busy you are. I am blessed with a hubby who always does more than his fair share in helping with the kids and household chores. He also knows how much I love my dogs and how much of a break they provide me. It's amazing how a half hour dog walk can totally change my perspective when my kids seem difficult to me.

                            My daughter's medical problems were numerous and scary. She is now almost two years old and healthy, happy and pretty much a normal toddler. My kids absolutely love the dogs and our cat. I can't imagine raising kids without pets. However, we constantly teach our kids that our pets are part of the family and they deserve the same respect and love that we all get. If your husband can't or won't reinforce these principles then you might be fighting an uphill battle that will just tire you further. Only you know the answer to that.

                            As for the digging, try burying her feces where she digs. Or consider burying ballons. The pop will likely scare her and discourage the digging.

                            Good luck to you, I hope you make a choice that is best for both you and your dogs.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              RE: Stuck between a rock and a hard place

                              I'm sorry hunny, it is such an awful position to be in! You have to many problems in your life going on to stress over this...and if your husband is threatning to get rid of her then like someone else said, find her a good home before he finds something. Great Danes are family dogs, they like to be in the warmth of their family's love, they like to lay on, chew on, slobber on anything that is comftorable to us like, the couch, the bed, etc...they don't like to be seperated from their family outside with another dog trying to find something to do other than keep occupied, that is why you are getting a digger...what else does she have to do? She's in a kennel, it is the same thing over and over, maybe she is even digging to lay in a cooler spot? I don't know, I just know that every single thing you read about Great Danes will usually mention "they are not outside dogs". and I do not think it could be any more clear, they are just not outside dogs. You just had a child, who needs your love and concentration right now, do what you know is right for Emma, let her experience the wonderful silly world of being family Great Dane.

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