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  • #16
    Ok thanks. Forums are a great thing

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    • #17
      Here's a link to a puppy lemon law article you may be interested in.

      http://www.pennstatelawreview.org/ar...Rev.%20643.pdf
      Nancy
      Calico Rock Danes
      Alabama

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      • #18
        Lots of info that addresses the immediate issue, and hoping things can be resolved and pup will have a happy life with your family as a much loved pet.

        Looking beyond the present, I really want to recommend you put any breeding goals on hold for awhile. Take time to learn about how to find a responsible breeder, genetics, the breed, and really look into joining a club. Even if you can't show this guy, you can learn a lot with him and about showing so that when you do get a show potential pup, you will be that much further ahead of the game.

        Breeding is an enormous responsibility, and harls have plenty of issues. Take your time, get involved in the breed, and I definitely recommend getting a mentor (more than one can be nice, too). I guarantee if you do those things and stick around DOL, you will look back a year from now and go "WOW"

        If you (or anyone reading this thread) hasn't been to JP's site, it is a good place to check out : http://www.chromadane.com/chlinx.htm

        PS - if you have a website and also breed rabbits, I really want to emphasize the part above about putting breeding goals on hold for awhile. I mean that in the most constructive way. Plenty of DOL members and those that love the breed have started in less than stellar ways -- but once they learned more and kept the breed's best interest at heart, it changed the path they were on. I'd like to reiterate a recent thread where Moni said "you have a right to breed your dog, but you have a responsibility not to".
        Last edited by Harlequin Dane; 09-06-2010, 09:44 PM.
        Mrs Emery
        AKC Canine Ambassador
        Member GDCA - resource/referral
        GOPDC - Public Education Coordinator

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        • #19
          Unfortunately, you are learning the hard way about the consequences of irresponsible breeding. I have checked out your website and really hope that you do decide to spay your two merle girls and don't breed them again especially now that you have been on the other side of a poor BYB purchase. Breeding merles goes against the colour code of ethics for the great dane club because of the dangers of the homozygous merle gene and the associated sensory defects. Independent, published health testing and third party conformation evaluation in a show ring are the responsibilities of a breeder for this very reason, to prevent genetic defects. Breeding merles go against colour code of ethics for the dane club. I am sorry about the structural problems that your little guy is struggling with, but he is the sad product of a cross color breeding between two dogs who should never have been bred, much like your own litters have been in the past. Without the health testing and showing, NOT having a pup like this is just lucky, rather than a planned product of careful selection of the best of the best. My hope is that radiographic evaluation and further exams from an orthopaedic veterinarian will yield a plan for his treatment so that he can live a long comfortable life as a spoiled and neutered pet.

          Breeding is far more than two dogs of the same breed that are 'pretty'.
          sigpic

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          • #20
            If I am viewing the correct website, It appears both of his parents carry this same leg issue.
            sigpic
            In Memory of Sky, EZ and Honor

            Visit Poke's Facebook Page

            Member of the GDC of MD.
            Well behaved danes are not born. They are “made” by responsible and caring dane owners.

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            • #21
              Question is the fawn dog you got from them ok or did the dog die from anything strange or at an early age they may be pumping out unhealthy puppies in general you may want to call AC on them if they are found to have bad conditions then it's even stronger for your case.

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              • #22
                Angel_ The fawn was great confirmation, personality and otherwise. She had gotten parvo at 6 months when a stray dog was around the neighborhood. The vet said it was odd because she had her shots but 2 had been done by the breeder so Im guessing they either werent done at all or werent done correctly. I have considered calling AC. The other pup that my friend got that has the infection was told by her vet that it was probably caused by her laying in nasty condition and malnutrition.

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                • #23
                  I never bred one of my merles and I planned on breeding the other to a black if I did breed her because of the light harl pup. If I dont spay her but shes a great dog, temperment and body. That was the first time I had bred her. I am not horrible for breeding a merle and I would do the right thing if there was a problem with ANY of the puppies. The only thing I did wrong was breed to a harl, but I learned and if I did breed her again would breed to a black. If she was bred to a black it would cancel the "white" gene. I still even have the runt of the litter because he is small and I wanted to be sure hes 100% ready when he going home since its a 9 hour trip. Just because I bred a merle which isnt color ethical doesnt mean I am a bad person. There are many merles being bred let alone harls to fawns and such and none of that means someone is bad. I have done lots of research since. Thats not why Im on here, I just needed help with this pup not lectured about something else that I would have asked on here about if I didnt already learn.

                  There is nothing wrong with this pup because he is from blue to harl breeding!!! I have no clue why you would think that...

                  Everyone started somewhere and made mistakes with their breeding somehow, nobodies perfect.

                  Originally posted by Paradis View Post
                  Unfortunately, you are learning the hard way about the consequences of irresponsible breeding. I have checked out your website and really hope that you do decide to spay your two merle girls and don't breed them again especially now that you have been on the other side of a poor BYB purchase. Breeding merles goes against the colour code of ethics for the great dane club because of the dangers of the homozygous merle gene and the associated sensory defects. Independent, published health testing and third party conformation evaluation in a show ring are the responsibilities of a breeder for this very reason, to prevent genetic defects. Breeding merles go against colour code of ethics for the dane club. I am sorry about the structural problems that your little guy is struggling with, but he is the sad product of a cross color breeding between two dogs who should never have been bred, much like your own litters have been in the past. Without the health testing and showing, NOT having a pup like this is just lucky, rather than a planned product of careful selection of the best of the best. My hope is that radiographic evaluation and further exams from an orthopaedic veterinarian will yield a plan for his treatment so that he can live a long comfortable life as a spoiled and neutered pet.

                  Breeding is far more than two dogs of the same breed that are 'pretty'.

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                  • #24
                    I dont think you are looking at the correct site. She didnt used to have pics of them on there but she might now. I dont think I am supposed to say her name or anything on here though


                    Originally posted by dolmod View Post
                    If I am viewing the correct website, It appears both of his parents carry this same leg issue.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by renegadedanes View Post
                      I dont think you are looking at the correct site. She didnt used to have pics of them on there but she might now. I dont think I am supposed to say her name or anything on here though
                      I'm looking at your pup on your site where it says click on his picture to see more of him and his parents. His parents should NEVER have been bred to ANYTHING. They both have terrible conformation and both look deformed in the rear.

                      Thats not why Im on here, I just needed help with this pup not lectured about something else that I would have asked on here about if I didnt already learn.
                      Help with your puppy includes trying to educate you on why this breeding should have never happened. His issues are caused by irresponsible breeding period.
                      As I said in my first post in this thread, you are in the exact right place to learn about responsible, ethical breeding. Which I'm sorry, but you are not doing any of the above.

                      Please dont' misunderstand. I'm sure your dogs are sweethearts and I'm sure you love them very much. I have two BYB merles myself and though their conformation is terrible, they are perfect in my eyes. But conformation is what creates a sound dog. My guys are spayed/neutered and will never contribute their poor conformation genes to the gene pool.

                      Please read up on some of the breeding forms. There is soooo much more to breeding than color or size. Showing, health testing, participating in the breed in order to find the best match for your sire/bitch... Its really best left to those who know what they're doing or who are being mentored by someone who knows what they're doing.
                      Until one has loved an animal, part of one's soul remains unawakened.
                      - Anatole France

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                      • #26
                        This dog is severely cowocked.
                        It could be due to several reasons:
                        1) genetics
                        2) lack of exercise
                        3) poor nutrition
                        4) back/hip problems
                        a combination of the above or more.

                        Conformationally he looks a wreck.
                        Since you paid a substantial amount of money for this "stud" prospect I would return him and get your money back.
                        Then instead of focusing on breeding, start at the basics........you can learn a TON from just reading here (be sure to read the archives) and also by visiting JPY's website and the GDCA.org site.

                        Good luck in your decision,
                        Carolyn
                        Divine Acres Great Danes
                        Divine Acres The Legend "Bruce" 5 1/2 months old..5th generation of DA Danes!
                        sigpic

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                        • #27
                          Even if the breeder was going to give you the difference back, would you be prepared for watching your dog in pain, having to have surgery done, or having to put him down early to end his suffering? This dog is a train wreck. I am not a breeder and do not show dogs, and I can see that he has serious issues. Maybe you should get into showing and meet people who are reputable breeders. Maybe you could switch your focus from breeding to rescuing. There are so many poorly bred dogs and homeless dogs already, why would you risk making more? You are at home and could totally focus on rehabilitating and rehoming homeless dogs. I understand that puppies are cute and sweet and fun, but what a service you could do by redirecting your time from breeding to rescuing. How would you feel if one of your puppies turned out like the one you have and you ended up putting someone through the heartache you are going through? Unless your dogs are shown and prove to be stellar examples of the breed, then how do you know that they should be bred? Just some thoughts.
                          Chris, Wife to Dave, and Mom three human teenagers.
                          Also mom to Tori (11 yo Lab), , Ayla (2 yo brindle dane), Milo (2 yo boxer), Killian (4 week old iw pup who is still with his breeder and mommy) 3 kittens, 2 horses, multiple reptiles, 7 fainting goats, 25 chickens, and 2 pot bellied pigs, all of whom make life great!
                          RIP CARLIE 2/09-2/11 & REILLY 10/4/08-11/20/12, best friends together forever now.

                          sigpic

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by renegadedanes View Post
                            Angel_ The fawn was great confirmation, personality and otherwise. She had gotten parvo at 6 months when a stray dog was around the neighborhood. The vet said it was odd because she had her shots but 2 had been done by the breeder so Im guessing they either werent done at all or werent done correctly. I have considered calling AC. The other pup that my friend got that has the infection was told by her vet that it was probably caused by her laying in nasty condition and malnutrition.
                            As far as shots go, if they aren't keep at the correct tempature they can be made ineffective, some most likely the breeder did not give the shots correctly in my opinion just more proof she owes you all your money back, I would return pup since he may just have a very short life which is a lot of heart break you don't need.

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                            • #29
                              Im reading all this and for the life of me am totally dumbfounded that you have gone back to this breeder for another pup? This time to buy a "stud" dog? WTH?

                              Im reading all these threads about people spending all this money to buy these sick pups and then spend hundreds to a couple thousand dollars fixing them.......are you kidding?

                              You bought this pup already knowing he was totally infested with worms, but figured that was an easy fix? How about buying from a breeder where the pups are healthy, happy and you dont have to worry about "fixing" anything or worry if the breeder actually did what they said they would do, like vaccinate?

                              The amount of time, energy, money and mental anguish that you buyers spend hashing over all these puppy problems has totally blown my mind! I bet you spent more money for this sick pup then most reputable breeders sell their dogs for.

                              I will say though, that no reputable breeder is going to sell a buyer a "stud" prospect to set themselves up as a backyard breeder, so if that really was your motive, about the only breeders willing to do that are other bybers.
                              Carolyn
                              Divine Acres Great Danes
                              Divine Acres The Legend "Bruce" 5 1/2 months old..5th generation of DA Danes!
                              sigpic

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                              • #30
                                [QUOTE=renegadedanes;599656]I didnt know you could check the OFA website so I did and neither sire nor dam was OFAd. Big suprise...
                                QUOTE]

                                Im sorry to hear she was lying. I didn't know much about checking up on the OFA records when i got my pup. He is perfectly healthy thankfully and I did find his parents on the OFA site but still just keep in mind OFA checks alone doesn't make a good breeder either. I wish you the best with your boy and just know that even if you can't do anything about the situation he still might end up being okay. Just don't breed him. He will for sure make a great pet regaurdless.
                                Last edited by Lacey; 09-07-2010, 11:52 AM.
                                sigpic Little boy!

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