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  • Any tips on introducing a new child??

    Dusty and Pearl are 28 and 32 months old. I also have two adult Begal cats but no other humans to compete with my attention as far as the Danes are concerned. I am going to have two girls move in bringing a 3 1/2 year old little boy. The Danes have had quite a few closely supervised visits including this child but nothing long term. My two biggest fears are that this little boy could antagonize one of the Danes into some behavior not before exhibited or that this little boy might simply let the dogs loose. I would appreciate any ideas or other obvious concerns. Thanks, Rob.
    _______
    ~ Rob ~

  • #2
    Hi Rob,

    I would baby gate sections of the house off until you have a better idea how the dogs and the little boy interact. I would never leave the child and the dogs unsupervised in a room together.

    Small children are just as unpredictable as dogs, and the combination of the two does not make it better.

    Also lock all the doors to the outside and pull off the keys, as an alternative you can install a sliding chain lock across the upper half of the door where the tike cannot reach it.

    I would start training with the mother of the child (since she is primarily responsible for her kid). And teach her what you want her to teach her son. Then I would make training sessions for mother and son with dogs.
    Everybody got to sit calm around, and Danes are getting fed treats from mother and son. Do that at least twice a day and your dogs will associate the tike with something good.

    And even if it sounds paranoid, better being too careful as being sorry later.
    Hope that helps
    Jeannette
    sigpic
    With best regards,
    Jeannette Luca & Leo and now Lilly & Sophie

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by jeann1230 View Post
      Hi Rob,

      I would baby gate sections of the house off until you have a better idea how the dogs and the little boy interact. I would never leave the child and the dogs unsupervised in a room together.

      Small children are just as unpredictable as dogs, and the combination of the two does not make it better.

      Also lock all the doors to the outside and pull off the keys, as an alternative you can install a sliding chain lock across the upper half of the door where the tike cannot reach it.

      I would start training with the mother of the child (since she is primarily responsible for her kid). And teach her what you want her to teach her son. Then I would make training sessions for mother and son with dogs.
      Everybody got to sit calm around, and Danes are getting fed treats from mother and son. Do that at least twice a day and your dogs will associate the tike with something good.

      And even if it sounds paranoid, better being too careful as being sorry later.
      Hope that helps
      Jeannette
      This all sounds like excellent advice--I was considering placing a second (much higher) doorknob on one critical door since the sliding chain lock is not passively engaged--particularly during heavy usage as when shlepping in groceries, unfamiliar company visiting etc.

      The training sounds good too. Another concern is the wagging tails on these happy Danes have brought me to my knees (after getting whacked in the twins) on many occasions. This kid will be face-high to their well intentioned but brutal tails.

      I am planning on chain-locking the fence gaits as well. Keep the ideas coming please!
      _______
      ~ Rob ~

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by RustyNail View Post
        The training sounds good too. Another concern is the wagging tails on these happy Danes have brought me to my knees (after getting whacked in the twins) on many occasions. This kid will be face-high to their well intentioned but brutal tails.
        Maybe this is mean, especially coming from a pregnant lady, but in my experience kids learn to duck.

        Seriously though, the only solution I know of for this problem is a solid "sit." Can't whack anybody if the tail is on the ground...
        Misty, Leonidas (Dane), and Valor (Pomeranian Mix)
        Current 52 Photo Project:http://flic.kr/s/aHsjDu8ALZ

        Comment


        • #5
          Hi Rob,

          yep the happy tail problem, my husband and other male visitors had some similar experiences as you. As for the child you also have the problem that the dogs tend to side swipe the kid with a shoulder bringing it to a fall and/or stepping on the tikes foot.

          I had those same problems when my nephew visited us when he was younger. I separated the Danes and child constantly, and when outside in the yard or on walks I put a helmet on the little guy. Also teach your dogs to lay down when they see the kid. Kid comes, dogs go automatically in a down. I taught mine this with oodles of treats.

          Teach the kid to keep a 5 foot radius around the dogs, and if caught in a corner, the kid goes in a down, butt on the floor, knees up, head down behind knees, arms over head. You can make a game out of it, training Danes and kid the same time. You say down, and whoever of these rascals get there first gets a treat (ähmm, but please use Gummi bears for the kid, works better then liver treats...)

          Good luck keep us updated.
          Jeannette
          sigpic
          With best regards,
          Jeannette Luca & Leo and now Lilly & Sophie

          Comment


          • #6
            Jeann has given great advice. The default sit or down when the dog sees the kid, but honestly, kids just have to learn to deal with stuff too. Mine learned quickly to walk around the dogs with their arms around their heads. Tail on arm hurts a lot less than tail smack across the face. When (not if) there is a collision, or otherwise hurt child, remind the kiddo that the dog didn't mean it, and if at all possible, have the dog "apologize" (mine love "kissing" tears). That always seems to help. Acknowledge the kid's hurt feelings, but don't over do either. Gotta move on quickly.

            As for general safety, supervise, supervise, supervise and train BOTH kid and dogs. I have a couple blogs on some basics for raising two leggeds and four leggeds together. Hopefully there are some ideas for you in there too.
            Until one has loved an animal, part of one's soul remains unawakened.
            - Anatole France

            Comment


            • #7
              First have the kid on leash and in handcuffs, so he can't charge the dog or swing out his arms and smack the dog...

              Really tho Jeann has good advice. Train the mom,the kid, and the dog, ALWAYS supervise, and keep interactions plesent. There is a book called "Raising puppies and kids together" - I would make it a homework assignment for you and mother of the child.
              sigpic
              "Show me your dog, and I will tell you what manner of man you are."
              ~Capt. Max von Stephanitz
              Anubis CGC (RIP) , Cheza CGC, Schwarz Frost von Lichtefeld CGCA THD TDIA, Steele Gunner Goatsbane CGCA, and Professional House Dog Oliver.

              Comment


              • #8
                I agree with everything above:

                NEVER, EVER leave them alone.

                The kid will learn to guard his face, BUT PLEASE tell the mother that accidents will happen and it will hurt, etc. Just so when it does they don't freak out. This may also put the mom on alert to pay closer attention. And since I follow number one rule above I am usually there to divert the tail with my hand before it hits any one or any thing.

                Training sessions with everyone in the house.

                If the kid wants to run and scream and be crazy dogs get put away.

                Dogs can only get crazy outside--no inside play or zoomies--just calm inside

                Mine I put in a down (sit isn't something they learn until they are adults here) this is much less intimidating for small kids.

                Toys and especially toys that make sounds can be strange for the dogs so just be alert with that too. I had one that didn't like noisy toys and I think she was trying to protect the kids because when one would make a noise she would run over and shove it away from the kid with her nose. A good leave it worked well for that!

                If you have stairs, dogs must wait while humans go first, no crowding or pushing

                Good luck!
                Meg
                AeroDanes

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by jeann1230 View Post
                  Hi Rob,

                  yep the happy tail problem, my husband and other male visitors had some similar experiences as you. As for the child you also have the problem that the dogs tend to side swipe the kid with a shoulder bringing it to a fall and/or stepping on the tikes foot.

                  I had those same problems when my nephew visited us when he was younger. I separated the Danes and child constantly, and when outside in the yard or on walks I put a helmet on the little guy. Also teach your dogs to lay down when they see the kid. Kid comes, dogs go automatically in a down. I taught mine this with oodles of treats.

                  Teach the kid to keep a 5 foot radius around the dogs, and if caught in a corner, the kid goes in a down, butt on the floor, knees up, head down behind knees, arms over head. You can make a game out of it, training Danes and kid the same time. You say down, and whoever of these rascals get there first gets a treat (ähmm, but please use Gummi bears for the kid, works better then liver treats...)

                  Good luck keep us updated.
                  Jeannette
                  This sounds hilarious yet very practical--i can gain the kid's interests by making the whole thing seem like a game in iinvolving him in the dog training--thanks!
                  _______
                  ~ Rob ~

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Great advice so far...To that I would just add, start having the child feed the dogs.Have the child put the dogs in a down/stay and wait until the child has placed bowls down. Then have the child release them to eat by saying "Okay" or whatever your release word is. Above all else, the dogs need to learn that kids are humans and they need to be respected.

                    My daughter started feeding Milly at age 4...It is possible, you just have to teach the kid what to do.

                    Heres a video I made...not the best, but you can see the gist of what I am talking about.Ignore messy house...right after Christmas before my brilliant painting project idea.

                    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FjNAghjMWE"]YouTube - 5 yr old feeds Great Dane[/ame]

                    ~Jeanne, Jason & Emily(6)-The Humans~
                    Milly-Harl GD,
                    Tank, Tigra Cougie & Jax-The Cat Crew
                    www.valparasiokennelclub.com

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Brindle baby View Post
                      I agree with everything above:

                      NEVER, EVER leave them alone.

                      The kid will learn to guard his face, BUT PLEASE tell the mother that accidents will happen and it will hurt, etc. Just so when it does they don't freak out. This may also put the mom on alert to pay closer attention. And since I follow number one rule above I am usually there to divert the tail with my hand before it hits any one or any thing.

                      Training sessions with everyone in the house.

                      If the kid wants to run and scream and be crazy dogs get put away.

                      Dogs can only get crazy outside--no inside play or zoomies--just calm inside

                      Mine I put in a down (sit isn't something they learn until they are adults here) this is much less intimidating for small kids.

                      Toys and especially toys that make sounds can be strange for the dogs so just be alert with that too. I had one that didn't like noisy toys and I think she was trying to protect the kids because when one would make a noise she would run over and shove it away from the kid with her nose. A good leave it worked well for that!

                      If you have stairs, dogs must wait while humans go first, no crowding or pushing

                      Good luck!
                      This sounds like a really good idea--Dusty and Pearl have a lot of toys and will probably consider the kid's toys to be fair game.
                      _______
                      ~ Rob ~

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by MillyVanilly View Post
                        Great advice so far...To that I would just add, start having the child feed the dogs.Have the child put the dogs in a down/stay and wait until the child has placed bowls down. Then have the child release them to eat by saying "Okay" or whatever your release word is. Above all else, the dogs need to learn that kids are humans and they need to be respected.

                        My daughter started feeding Milly at age 4...It is possible, you just have to teach the kid what to do.

                        Heres a video I made...not the best, but you can see the gist of what I am talking about.Ignore messy house...right after Christmas before my brilliant painting project idea.

                        YouTube - 5 yr old feeds Great Dane
                        Thank you for this vdeo--I have already trained the kid to put Dusty and Pearl in a sit or a down using premium treats (raw beef chunks) but I have not introduced him as a feeder/provider figure which helps establish that he is human/leader etc. Thanks again--I'm starting to build some confidence and to organize my initial approaches--and your other videos are good too!
                        _______
                        ~ Rob ~

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Excellent advice given so far!

                          I have three children - ages 7,7 and 4. Since birth our children have always had a Dane around (except for the time between the passing of our old girl and getting our pup.) The kids have grown up with dogs in our house and are very respectful of dogs - because we have taught them how to appropriately interact and they have mastered (almost) all of the defensive tactics needed to keep them safe! We try to induce zoomies so the kids aren't caught off guard with a surprise attack. We make sure the kids are safe and secure and then Zia can zoom, zoom, zoom! If she does get a sudden surge, then they all know how to "assume the position!" On the other side of it, we have taught her how to zoom right into her crate if the kids are in the middle of something. That has come in handy when she is zooming and also as a quick intervention if we need it.

                          I think it is important to have boundaries and expectations for both the children and the dog. I am very protective of my dogs! I don't blame you for worrying about a 3 1/2 year old antagonizing them....kids can traumatize dogs. I'm pretty strict with certain things...my son may NOT chase the dog with his remote control car! My daughters may NOT get a kick out of trying to vacuum up the dog! My nephew may NOT shoot my pup with his Nerf gun! They're good kids, but they'd totally try it if they could!

                          Again on the other hand, Zia may not participate in my husband's wrestling matches with the kids. Zia needs to assume her own position in her crate when it's my kids' turn to have the zoomies. She also has to be crated if she has any kind of high value treat (even though I know they'd be able to take it right away, it's just not a chance I take.)

                          I think being one step ahead always helps. The more awareness you have the more successful you will be. As other members have mentioned, it's important to include the child's mother - actually everyone in the house should be on the same page...I'd even post rules with little pictures the little guy could understand....hey, I'm a teacher - I can get over the top with things like that!

                          Good luck with this transition!
                          sigpic

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by NMDane View Post

                            "assume the position!"
                            We use "take cover!"
                            Meg
                            AeroDanes

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I have already trained the kid to put Dusty and Pearl in a sit or a down using premium treats (raw beef chunks) but I have not introduced him as a feeder/provider figure which helps establish that he is human/leader etc.
                              Hi Rob,

                              one caution to your statement above. The dogs will recognize the tod as a human, no question, but no grown dog will ever see him as a leader. They will only take their cue from you. Yes, they will learn that the tike is precious to you and that their have to be careful around him, and they will learn to follow a command from him as long as you are present, but otherwise they see him as a human puppy. Which in turn means that an adult dog might feel it has to correct the little guy like they would a puppy. And pinches and air snaps will not seriously hurt a puppy, but can cause injuries to a child.

                              So never let your guard down, and never leave them alone. Otherwise do check out Ouesi's blog there is really good advice there for raising skin and furr kids together.
                              sigpic
                              With best regards,
                              Jeannette Luca & Leo and now Lilly & Sophie

                              Comment

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