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Does Registerable Mean Breedable?

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  • Does Registerable Mean Breedable?

    Can a few here help me (us all!) out by finding a few links to explain about how the AKC (other such registries) work? I've gotten another of those notes from a DOLer saying her dogs, who are disqualified under the standard, are breedable as the "AKC told her so" by giving her papers on them--that means (she said) they are breedable! We need to go over this again, as again we have a new crop of enthusiastic would-be breeders who need access to the very, very basic info--so anything to help. Please?

    The other thing is, any links out there to try explain to people that to want to breed purebred dogs is to love what they are, not what you want to make of them? Breeds have standards, so Golden Retrievers must be golden, Flat-Coats must have flat-coats, Chihuahuas must be small and Danes must be big. You can love a small Dane, but you cannot love Danes as a breed & a breeder if you want to breed 26" Danes, Danes all with yellow eyes, or take Danes from their own tradition of color and make them like Greyhounds (a "color immaterial" breed). Might as well say so many have snipey muzzles, so we ought to breed for lack of lip, as to say, so many come in other colors, we ought to do away with known colors--or that we can breed a "mini" version--why not--lots would like an apartment-sized Dane, so what's wrong with that, you are only then sharing what you love?

    What's wrong with all of this is that a purebred is preserved thru its standard. You don't have to love purebreds, but if you have fallen in love with some breed, the first place you go to see what makes that breed distinct IS its standard and the last thing you would do, loving that breed is to start saying what is wrong with the standard, how it should be changed to accomodate what you like (esp. if you are new & must admit your journey in the breed then is just started!). We are supposed to dedicate ourselves (as breeders) to preserving this breed, it's not ours to play with, turn into something we like "better" & I'd submit if Danes won't do as they are, maybe there is a breed that would fit those folks better? After all like 700 breeds out there, so surely a better fit if you come in to this breed and the first thing you do is complain about it and want to change it?

    Most here love the breed for what it is & want to see it endure (for all THAT is not easy for a giant dog like the Dane in the 21 century!) So can some here provide some inspiring notes and/or links for folks who are restless in this breed & think it should be other than it is? THey can then read this, fall in or out of love with Danes, learn to appreciate the breed as it is, or maybe find one that suits better. It's like falling in love. You don't do this & then try to change the person. You either love them as they are, or you don't love them enough & need to move on. Deep knowledge brings with it delight or dismissal? Help find a few things to help folks who like this breed but are not sure they really are "in love" yet? Thanks.

  • #2
    RE: Does Registerable Mean Breedable?

    AKC Registered and Quality

    There is a widely held belief that "AKC" or "AKC papers" and quality are one and the same. This is not the case. AKC is a registry body. A registration certificate identifies the dog as the offspring of a known sire and dam, born on a known date. It in no way indicates the quality or state of health of the dog. Quality in the sense of "show quality" is determined by many factors including the dog's health, physical condition, ability to move and appearance. Breeders breeding show stock are trying to produce animals that closely resemble the description of perfection described in the breed standard. Many people breed their dogs with no concern for the qualitative demands of the breed standard. When this occurs repeatedly over several generations, the animals, while still pure-bred, can be of extremely low quality.

    from the AKC site:
    In Memory of Sky, EZ and Honor

    Visit Poke's Facebook Page

    Member of the GDC of MD.
    Well behaved danes are not born. They are “made” by responsible and caring dane owners.


    • #3
      RE: Does Registerable Mean Breedable?

      Actually, that's one of the things that I love about being a pet sitter...I get to help educate owners, whom for the most part ,WANT to learn. I have had many conversations about breeding pets that are "AKC papered". One of the most helpful analogies I have found to explain the AKC as simply a registry is to tell the owners that they could have a litter of puppies with no legs and they could still get AKC papers. That seems to make more sense than just telling about breed standard and health testing alone which I then go into with them.

      I also offer to help anyone looking for a new puppy, I gladly put in the hours of research to help people buy from a reputable breeder.


      • #4
        RE: Does Registerable Mean Breedable?

        To support your statement, I'll give you 2 different breed examples, both involving my sister. She bought a Golden from a BYB, and she 'inherited' 3 dogs (1 a Chow) when her mother-in-law died.

        The Golden Retriever - I heard my sis say out loud, "I wonder why he's so small". He is a pretty dog, but much smaller than the breed standard.

        The Chow - I heard my bro-in-law tell me that only one of the other 3 dogs was purebred. The only thing resembling a Chow was its heavy coat & tongue. Otherwise it looked like a mixed breed.

        These are examples of what happens when you breed animals that do not meet the breed standard.




        • #5
          RE: Does Registerable Mean Breedable?

          When I was in my 20's, I bought a Sibe from a BYB. He told me to get his AKC papers and I could breed him, get a bitch from the litter, and I guess start my own little BYB operation. I remember reading a husky book and seeing my guy had a lot of "flaws", now this was when he was older (and nuetered), I couldn't help but wonder how this guy could tell me I had breeding stock based on a goofy little 12 week old fuzz ball. Fast forward til now, and with my DOL wisdom, I see just what he was all about.

          Stupid people shouldn't breed....anything !


          • #6
            RE: Does Registerable Mean Breedable?

            And Reputable doesn't always mean reputable.
            13 years ago I bought a yellow lab from a "Reputable Breeder" His dogs were great. Grand champs and BIS. Well.... I got put over the barrel. He sold me a pup fully registered and told me that if she "filled out nice" I may want to think about breeding her, due to her "Oh so impressive line and Price"....(realy pour it on thick and make'm think it is an investment). She did have papers and they were impressive, but a year later I wondered why she had a long coat and thicker underhair, and she was lighter built than a lab. (thank god I had no intention of ever breeding) Well I did some snooping and found out that this guys sister raised and showed Goldens. Yep you guessed it. That particular litter was a Suprise and because they looked more like the labs as pups, he was selling them off to pet homes and taking advantage of uneducated buyers. I was able to locate two others who also bought from the same litter. One looked like a Golden and the other looked like mine.

            She turned out to be a wonderful dog, and we loved her very much.


            • #7
              RE: Does Registerable Mean Breedable?

              I’ve thought a lot about this topic a long time before I decided to put my 2 cents worth in.

              Although I am new to Danes, I am not new to purebred dogs.

              I remember the first English Springer I ever saw, a friend of mine owned him, and OMG, I thought he was the most beautiful dog I’d ever seen.

              My friend began reading about showing dogs. And hey, she had to purebred dogs, with papers. We were going to do it! Well, we knew we were not as knowledgeable as we needed to be to just jump right in, so we decided we’d first go to one of those things they called a fun matche. There was one being held the next weekend just about an hour’s drive from us. So the day of the match, we bathed and groomed the dogs, loaded them up in the Bronco, and off we went.

              When we got there, we looked around and there were all these crates, and tables, and blow dryers, and tack boxes and...and...and all this other stuff! You can imagine how bewildered we looked standing there with her dogs in their pet collars and leashes (with their names embroidered on them!!), and our Hartz brushes...and nothing else! I looked at her and said “We have a lot more research and studying to do!”

              When we saw the other Springers, our mouths fell open and we both proclaimed they were even more beautiful (as hard as that was to believe) than her boys. But we didn’t let them hear us.

              When I finally got my first “show dog”, I knew she was perfect, the most perfect bitch God ever put on this earth. She was beautiful, had an excellent temperament and an excellent coat. Ok, so she kinda crabbed when she gaited. But, who could deny this wonderful love of my life? She was perfect! I couldn’t understand why she never finished.

              As I studied and researched I realized she crabbed because she was straight in the shoulders and didn’t have as much reach as she did drive! Ah HA! A light bulb went on!

              Even though I loved that dog with all my heart and she was my dearest friend for well over 15 years, I learned to look at her with a critical eye, and compare her to the breed standard. Her head was a little domey, her coat was a little too curly, she had good rear angulation, a great Springer temperament, etc.

              Then, I had to ask myself, honestly could I “improve” by breeding her, and if I did, what did I need to look for in a stud dog? Over the course of 3 years, I contemplated and researched...not only the breed standard, but the health issues of the breed, the genetic pros and cons on the breed, and talked to every show breeder I could get to answers my questions. Well, ok, I asked them questions every time I saw them at a show, until I’m sure they were all ready to gag and bind me and throw me in a dumpster!

              The way I figure it is, the breed standard is there for a reason. And as a breeder, if you are not going to protect and preserve the breed you love...who will?

              To finish my story on "the love and friend of my life'. Yes I did breed her, once. And the some of the puppies were an improvement towards the standard. We finished 4 of the 8 puppies. The other 4 were sold to pet homes, with spay and nuture contracts along with the promise of a refund of the cost of the spay/nuture with proof in writing from the vet that performed the surgery..btw, all of them did get their refunds.

              Over the course of owning and breeding, I never took my eye off the standard. I’ve had champions that I never bred and I have had dogs I’ve never finished that I did breed.

              I think the greatest lesson I take to heart’s not about how my heart feels about one particular dog...faults or no fault, I would love them the same. It’s about the preservation of the breed I love so much.

              Now as for my one Dane, Bo...he’s a joy, a love and a delight to our home, but he will not be bred. His genetic make up is very scary. Do I love him? Oh so much! But my love of this dog is not what breeding is about.



              • #8
                RE: Does Registerable Mean Breedable?



                I enjoyed your message.

                I remember my first Dane and my first dog show, like it was yesterday....instead of over 30 years ago.
                At my training class, all the other Dane owners were SO kind.
                They encouraged me to enter and show matter that she didn't place, unless she was the only one in her class.
                I thought how nice these Dane people are.......until it dawned on me, that they knew she was no competition, and only wanted us there to build the points.:9 :9

                So I showed, and lost until I encountered a judge that was honest with me.
                When I questioned him about her future, he you love her?
                Sure I said.
                Then he said.......then take her home and love her.:9 :9

                So you live, and hopefully learn.