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  • #16
    Originally posted by Kumah View Post
    There's absolutely nothing wrong with using a merle for breeding stock. There are quite a few reputable breeders who breed merle. The key is to color test both intended parents to ensure they cannot produce the lethal gene if they were both to carry for merle. If I remember correctly you should only breed a merle to a non merle/harl carrying mantle or a non harl carrying black. As long as they take the precautions of finding an appropriate mate, you can breed Merle and still end up with a show quality puppy in the litter.
    This is great news, it's been a long time coming.
    A pretty well known breeder fairly recently bred a merle mantle to a mantle and threw a litter of 100% show marked mantles. They're too young to know how they'll do in the ring, but (in my opinion) a litter of 100% show marked mantles is a pretty amazing thing.

    Merles can be used in a breeding program exactly how harles should be used (but sometimes aren't). By color testing and breeding carefully and thoughtfully
    sigpic

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    • #17
      Originally posted by emeko View Post
      We know merles are perfectly healthy, and can throw perfectly healthy babies as long as double merle is kept out of the equation.
      Sweet! Good to know. Ya learn something new every day.
      sigpic
      Willow and Liv

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      • #18
        Genetically speaking, a merle breeds the same as a harl. Merle+harlequin modifier= harlequin. The only thing you're missing with a merle (for now) is the ability to show and that whole third party opinion thing. Then again, I've seen a few Ch and even GCh Danes who look so weird there's no way I'd want one of their offspring. Those instances make me think the judges were smoking something before they went to the ring.

        I have not personally met Ferg's momma, but Shark's was a big beautiful doggy merle mantle bitch, and I bet she'd have done wonderfully in the conformation ring.
        sigpic
        Fergus
        SC Dinnie Stone Guardian, CGC
        Eisen Shark
        C Shadows On The Sun, CGC

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        • #19
          This is a step, but we will just have to see if the ball keeps rolling. Votes are due May 1st. You have to remember that, just as another poster commented, for years Dane fanciers were taught that merles should not be bred. We know now that harlequins ARE merles, but with a modified gene causing all grey to be white. You would breed a merle just like a harlequin. If merles are accepted, 100% of harl x mantle and merle x mantleH litters will be showable.

          This will be a major change. It will be difficult to rewrite what has been taught about merles. Although I have seen nothing but positive responses to this motion, we know that the majority of the sport are nonharl competitors who have not done much research on the merle gene. Took over 20 yrs to accept the mantle. Keep the questions coming so we can all be educated

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Lizgirl View Post
            This is a step, but we will just have to see if the ball keeps rolling. Votes are due May 1st. You have to remember that, just as another poster commented, for years Dane fanciers were taught that merles should not be bred. We know now that harlequins ARE merles, but with a modified gene causing all grey to be white. You would breed a merle just like a harlequin. If merles are accepted, 100% of harl x mantle and merle x mantleH litters will be showable.

            This will be a major change. It will be difficult to rewrite what has been taught about merles. Although I have seen nothing but positive responses to this motion, we know that the majority of the sport are nonharl competitors who have not done much research on the merle gene. Took over 20 yrs to accept the mantle. Keep the questions coming so we can all be educated
            Provided they keep those damn piebalds out of there! :P

            What is the whole process of getting merle accepted?
            sigpic
            Fergus
            SC Dinnie Stone Guardian, CGC
            Eisen Shark
            C Shadows On The Sun, CGC

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            • #21
              Well first we need votes for a draft. Then the draft will likely be debated for a while with revisions and voting (in regards to preferences and allowances). Whether to accept solid merles and merle mantles will probably be debated and voted on. Once a final draft is agreed upon, it will be voted on by the GDCA membership (2/3 vote passes??). The standard can only be revised every 5 years. I heard the earliest the standard can be revised would be 2016. I do not believe we will get through this process before the end of 2016.

              I believe this will be a shot heard round the world if the GDCA accepts merles. Many other clubs will likely follow suit, so such a change will be very cautiously written and evaluated.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Lizgirl View Post
                Well first we need votes for a draft. Then the draft will likely be debated for a while with revisions and voting (in regards to preferences and allowances). Whether to accept solid merles and merle mantles will probably be debated and voted on. Once a final draft is agreed upon, it will be voted on by the GDCA membership (2/3 vote passes??). The standard can only be revised every 5 years. I heard the earliest the standard can be revised would be 2016. I do not believe we will get through this process before the end of 2016.

                I believe this will be a shot heard round the world if the GDCA accepts merles. Many other clubs will likely follow suit, so such a change will be very cautiously written and evaluated.
                Every 5 years the standard can be revised, or it just has to be 5 years after the last revision? Like if this process isn't complete by the end of 2016, would it be 2021 before it could be revised?
                sigpic
                Fergus
                SC Dinnie Stone Guardian, CGC
                Eisen Shark
                C Shadows On The Sun, CGC

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by SuzanneRM82 View Post
                  Every 5 years the standard can be revised, or it just has to be 5 years after the last revision? Like if this process isn't complete by the end of 2016, would it be 2021 before it could be revised?
                  At least 5 years after the last revision. So, not a now or never (2021) type deal

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Lizgirl View Post
                    At least 5 years after the last revision. So, not a now or never (2021) type deal
                    Oh, good. That's not so bad then.
                    sigpic
                    Fergus
                    SC Dinnie Stone Guardian, CGC
                    Eisen Shark
                    C Shadows On The Sun, CGC

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Thanks for the updates and the information. I guess I just thought that it was one of those rules that could never be changed. Fingers crossed that they will at least consider the possibility.

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                      • #26
                        From the GDCA Facebook page:

                        MERLE VOTE PASSED!!
                        May 6, 2016
                        From the Standard Committee...
                        The results are in! Yes: 273, No: 87, Abstain: 3

                        So stoked!!
                        sigpic
                        Willow and Liv

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                        • #27
                          OMG !!!! Never, ever did I think I'd see the day when the Merle coat color was approved. WOO HOO !!!!
                          sigpicCelle: 7/1/14, my current problem child
                          Chance: 9/3/05, the stray kitten that Jena brought home
                          Jena: 6/2/99 - 10/6/09 R.l.P. my heart dog (merle GD)

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                          • #28
                            I think there are still some steps to go, but it's awesome to see people are on board with it. I wonder how they'll develop the standard for it... merles are so "unstandard" by nature, I'll be curious to see what they decide are the ideal colours/markings/patternings, etc. Of course, I'm fairly sure they'll just use Miss Peach to set the ideal standard
                            sigpic

                            Peach, merle Great Dane
                            Born July 7 2014
                            Peach & Emily!

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                            • #29
                              No changes to the current GDCA written AKC standard have been approved. This vote was just to get an idea of interest in allowing the Standard Committee to write a standard for the merle color to be voted on at a later date.

                              There are quite a few breeds that allow merle in their standard. I imagine the committee will reference those breeds standard to help assist in the write up. I think the biggest question we are all waiting to hear is whether the possible merle standard will include both mantle pattern merle and solid merle. Since they are apart of the harlequin and mantle family, both which prefer a boston pattern, it will be interesting to see if one or the other will have a preference. The goal is for harlequin/mantle breeders to be able to pick the best puppy out of their entire litter based on structure and temperament rather than color. Correct color is still very much apart of the Great Dane standard

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by emeko View Post
                                I think there are still some steps to go, but it's awesome to see people are on board with it. I wonder how they'll develop the standard for it... merles are so "unstandard" by nature, I'll be curious to see what they decide are the ideal colours/markings/patternings, etc. Of course, I'm fairly sure they'll just use Miss Peach to set the ideal standard
                                I've been wondering the same thing bout patterns, color, and markings. One reason I love Merle's so much is the huge variations of shades of gray and size&amount of patching on their coat. You never see two Merle's that look exactly alike. I'm guessing for this though they will want the color to be similar to that of the harl color standard. Patches on the body and head and a clear-ish neck. I'm glad to see there is a significant interest in approving a written standard for Merle. From what I've seen, it will be 2018 before we would see Merle in the ring but this is a great start.
                                ~Kelsey, mom to~
                                Kumah-merle Great Dane 4 years
                                Nala-fawn Great Dane 2 months
                                Cece- Calico 4 years
                                Sammy- Black Domestic Long Hair 3 years
                                Tyke- 4 months

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